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[liberationtech] BB in the news again
email at franciscorrigan.com
Fri Aug 12 01:45:29 PDT 2011
The UK is considering introducing a number of responses to the recent
disturbances and no doubt the more repressive regimes will adopt such:
Police to have power to shut down social networks, remove hoodies and
>From detaining rioters in Wembley Stadium to spraying them with dye
Just change the work rioter to protester and the distinction will easily
----- Original message -----
From: "Ale Fernandez" <skoria at gmail.com>
To: liberationtech at lists.stanford.edu
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2011 15:02:25 +0200
Subject: Re: [liberationtech] BB in the news again
All this makes me think of community alarm systems: I'm just emailing my
old hackspace in Bristol to see if they'd be into making one.
But a wider use would be some kind of crowdsourced community alarm
system, across a whole neighbourhood or town.
I think people don't trust the police, and don't want to tell police
stuff, especially if it's a family member who is thinking of maybe
rioting, but they still want to protect their neighbourhood. There are
even lots of people who do want to riot, or just peacefully protest, but
for a just cause and concrete demands etc - so they might be anti police
for good reasons.
So while the police can't monitor BBM, people can protect their streets,
and even inform police somehow without having to shop their friends or
family. So politically removing the direct focus with police in this,
but still allowing people to make calls for help, might be a good step
On 10/08/11 14:39, Eric King wrote:
> This is a great post explaining the difference between enterprise vs
> non-enterprise RIM crypto and lawful access.
> It is also unclear currently exactly what is being handed over by RIM,
> but Simon McKay's analysis seems correct to me. However if the riots
> continue, I wouldn't be surprised if different routes were used.
> Under the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act (RIPA), police can
> apply for details of a customer's phone records, including their
> location, details of calls made and received, and internet activity.
> But requests must be made for each suspect on a case-by-case basis.
> Police would be unable to carry out a broad-based search, identifying,
> for example, every person who was in Clapham Junction sending the word
> Continue reading the main story
> “Start Quote
> Similar to other technology providers in the UK we comply with the
> Patrick SpenceBlackberry
> "They would have to say we want this individual's comms data and these
> are the reasons why," said solicitor advocate Simon McKay, who has
> written a book on the subject.
> "When it comes to the next person they would have to look at that
> completely separately and re-apply."
> Initial identification data would likely need to be taken from video,
> photographs, CCTV footage and other intelligence.
> Those limits mean telecoms subscriber data becomes useful additional
> evidence, rather than a first port of call.
> Mr McKay explained that, when considering requests, the issue of
> collateral intrusion also had to be taken into account - specifically,
> how much of other people's data might inadvertently be disclosed, along
> with that of the suspect.
> On 10 Aug 2011, at 01:30 PM, liberationtech at lewman.us wrote:
>> On Tue, Aug 09, 2011 at 02:26:14PM -0400, katrin at mobileactive.org
>> wrote 1.7K bytes in 46 lines about:
>> : David Lammy, Britain's intellectual property minister, also called
>> : for a suspension of Blackberry's encrypted instant message service.
>> : Many rioters, exploiting that service, had been able to organize mobs
>> : and outrun the police, who were ill-equipped to monitor it. "It is
>> Just a thought, the BB messenger service is like any other instant
>> messaging service where the users all connect and chat through a central
>> server. In this case, RIM runs the servers. The data is encrypted
>> between the user and the RIM servers, but not between users. Therefore,
>> RIM should be able to see all of the text contained in the chats. If RIM
>> has any sort of logs, they could potentially compile a list of all those
>> rioting, or hand this data over the UK Police (once requested properly).
>> I realize the police are ill-equipped to decrypt these conversations
>> as they fly through the air from the user's handset to the tower to
>> RIM's servers.
>> Another possibility is that the UK police could do basic traffic
>> analysis of transmissions and figure out what a BBM chat looks like
>> over the air/tower compared to phone calls to narrow down the set of
>> people from which to request data.
>> pgp key: 0x74ED336B
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