Search Mailing List Archives

Limit search to: Subject & Body Subject Author
Sort by: Reverse Sort
Limit to: All This Week Last Week This Month Last Month
Select Date Range     through    

[liberationtech] Rise of a Cybered Westphalian Age

Jayapragas Gnaniah gjayapragas at
Mon Jul 18 20:18:28 PDT 2011

On Monday, July 18, 2011,  <liberationtech at> wrote:
> On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 01:50:14PM +0200, moritz at wrote 2.5K bytes in 64 lines about:
> : Title :   Rise of a Cybered Westphalian Age
> I've read through this document a few times now. I keep coming back to
> a few thoughts.
> The first thought is that this is a military paper for a military
> audience. It is eactly how I would expect a military person to write
> about the future of the Internet. Or at least they Internet they want to
> see happen.
> A second thought is about a conversation I had with the Ambassador of
> Human Rights from Sweden.  We discussed a variety of topics in our time
> together, but one that kept coming up was the militarization of the
> Internet and subsequent effects. The ideas that the Internet is
> primarily a military space and can be commandeered as needed, that the
> Internet is a physical entity and the network effects are no different
> than the pioneer towns and frontiers every nation has experienced
> throughout its history, and that most people don't understand the
> technological capabilities available to those on the Internet and how
> they can fundamentally differ from real world experiences.
> Each one of these topics is a paper of its own, but suffice it to say that
> the military view of the Internet is very different than a human right's
> view, or a commercial view, or even a child's view of the Internet.
> Never underestimate the ability of two horomone-flushed teenagers to
> circumvent any rules to spend time together. An example could be
> teenagers from Party and other well-to-do families in North Korea. The
> military view of these actions is subterfuge, treason, and imminent
> threats to control and order. To the teenagers, it's just two people
> wanting to hang out and talk about their lives.
> The third thought is that this mentality of being under seige and
> needing to take defensive and offensive positions to real or imagined
> adversaries on the Internet is such a binary position that any other
> states, ternary or otherwise are simply dismissed as shades of gray in a
> black and white battlefield. I have no doubt that US Military networks
> and computers are being attacked by sophisticated unknown parties across
> the Internet. I've also had conversations with people in the chain of
> command about ICMP packets (ping) being weaponized and clearly the
> threat of an adversary. When someone ping sweeps a network range, it's
> assumed this is only a weaponized assualt on a network, where every
> packet sent increased the total attack count. Heck, I pinged the
> gateway at a place once and the network admins were convinced I was
> trying to attack the network. In reality, I was just trying to figure
> out how overloaded their network was by getting an average latency
> between me and the first hop. It's something every network admin does
> thousands of times a day. This is how one arrives at statistics like
> 'billions of attacks'.
> It seems the military answer is to change the Internet into a space it
> understands, make the rules that play to their strengths, and treat
> it like a battlefield. Again, this is a paper by military authors for a
> military audience. I've heard this vision of the Internet many times
> over the past two years.
> I also wonder if some politician in China had an orgasm that some part
> of the American military justified, even complemented, the Chinese model
> of Internet censorship.
> Thankfully, the US military and government aren't of one mind and
> action. Everyone is entitled to their thoughts, opinions, and freedom of
> speech.
> --
> Andrew
> pgp key: 0x74ED336B
> _______________________________________________
> liberationtech mailing list
> liberationtech at
> Should you need to change your subscription options, please go to:
> If you would like to receive a daily digest, click "yes" (once you click above) next to "would you like to receive list mail batched in a daily digest?"
> You will need the user name and password you receive from the list moderator in monthly reminders.
> Should you need immediate assistance, please contact the list moderator.
> Please don't forget to follow us on!/Liberationtech

More information about the liberationtech mailing list