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[liberationtech] Email privacy

scarp scarp at
Tue Jan 29 19:57:08 PST 2013

Hash: SHA512

André Rebentisch:
> The analogy was entering a house without permission because the
> locker (as all lockers) is unsafe or the door isn't closed.

Yes and if you woke up and someone was in your living room, you'd be
like "wtf" are you doing in my house!. If someone accessed a gmail
sever to spy on you, you'd never know, and there probably wouldn't be
a warrant either because requests under the "protection of national
security" usually include a gag order.

>> Over time people's perceptions of privacy will and have changed.
>> This means they are less outraged by proposed draconian laws,
>> assuming things continue down the same path as they have so far.
> 25 years ago mass surveillance of telecommunications was still
> very common. I can't believe in aggravation.
> DPR IMCO 148 is a quite interesting amendment, carried by the
> Internal Market Committee (IMCO) recently 
>  "on condition that no personal data are made accessible to an
> indefinite number of people;"

That might be a nice law for the EU, but for data placed on US servers
does it apply? I remember reading a while back about conflict between
the Patriot Act and EU data privacy laws.

>> If you put your data on someone else's servers then there is
>> always the possibility that they can hand it over, either legally
>> or illegally.
> I am not saying that you share these views but it is a pattern:
> First persons muse about raising security/privacy (levels), and
> when data was not kept secure/private they say, it's public anyway
> and we won't respect your data sovereignty. Or the attitude: when
> you store your mails with gmail then you *deserve* that a foreign
> government dares to read your mails.  Analogy: When I lock my door
> and you could still get in with a picklock then you'd also enjoy
> the right to enter my house because my locker was unsecure.

That's also legal in some parts of the world:

> Police are allowed in some circumstances to install hidden
> surveillance cameras on private property without obtaining a search
> warrant, a federal judge said yesterday.

> For the EU single market our Cloud services have to be under our 
> jurisdiction or third nations guarantee to refrain from infringing
> our data privacy. Data protection laws provide sanctions, design
> principles, practices, institutions. Fortunately the European Union
> has the gravity to raise global standards.
> See:
> Best, André

and hopefully they do, because there's a number of countries
considering global surveillance schemes. One in particular is
Australia with their National Security Inquiry.

- -- 


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