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[liberationtech] Boundless Informant: the NSA's secret tool to track global surveillance data

Brian Conley brianc at smallworldnews.tv
Sun Jun 9 07:25:13 PDT 2013


+1 to the tone comments, but my verdict is still out on greenwald, though
until I see the lawyers and privacy people talking a big game (not just
executives) I would tend to believe there is more than a grain of accuracy.
On Jun 9, 2013 6:45 AM, "Nadim Kobeissi" <nadim at nadim.cc> wrote:

> Jake,
> I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but I'm really tired
> of just how aggressive and rude you always are on Libtech. And it doesn't
> appear to just be towards me. I'm not the only person who feels like this.
>
> Even if you're right, tone your ego knob down already. Be nice. I can
> barely read through threads anymore. Thank you.
>
> NK
>
> On 2013-06-09, at 9:15 AM, Jacob Appelbaum <jacob at appelbaum.net> wrote:
>
> > x z:
> >> 2013/6/8 Jacob Appelbaum <jacob at appelbaum.net>
> >>
> >>> Oh man, Glenn Greenwald is my hero and a hero to us all.
> >>
> >>
> >> Do you still believe Glenn's reporting that NSA has "direct access to
> >> servers of firms including Google, Apple and Facebook"?
> >
> >
> > Yeah, I think it is clearly a FISA interface or API of some kind. Either
> > that or it is pwnage of the server. Probably one or the other in some
> cases.
> >
> >> In my view, he
> >> misled the world intentionally (the few prism training slides published
> did
> >> not seem to claim this). Glenn is at best a wacky journalist without
> common
> >> sense.
> >
> > He just broke the story of the decade, good to know your views on him.
> >
> >>
> >> His reporting on the Verizon case was good, but I think his credibility
> >> bankrupted after the PRISM one.
> >
> > We disagree, obviously. You'll see soon enough and when you're eating
> > crow, I'm sure we'll have another discussion.
> >
> >>
> >> Everyone on
> >>> this list who was looking for 'some evidence' about global surveillance
> >>> and previously ignored all other evidence, well, here you go!
> >>>
> >>> "Revealed: The NSA's powerful tool for cataloguing data – including
> >>> figures on US collection"
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/08/nsa-boundless-informant-global-datamining
> >>>
> >>> This screenshot from the program is very web 2.0:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/6/8/1370715185657/boundless-heatmap-large-001.jpg
> >>>
> >>> The NSA is spying on the US and on the rest of the planet. There is no
> >>> ability to deny this anymore. Anyone who denies it is a complete moron.
> >>>
> >>> I don't understand why this "evidence" is significant in any way. NSA
> >> certainly has lots of information, and a web2.0'ish tool is nothing
> >> surprising. It's rather moot to state "anyone who denies it is a
> complete
> >> moron". It's like the highway patrol keeping my driving record.
> >>
> >
> > Why does it matter if you are surprised?
> >
> > Also, your analogy is tired and boring. This is nothing like a highway
> > patrol.
> >
> >> Again, I'm not rooting for NSA. I think its power need to be limited
> and it
> >> needs more transparency. But I hate using misinformation or hyperbole to
> >> achieve that goal. This hurts the credibility of all the pro-privacy
> groups
> >> in general.
> >
> > I don't see any misinformation or hyperbole from Glenn. I see
> > contradicting claims between governments and corporations. I also see
> > that he wanted to ensure everyone understood what each side claimed.
> > Note the very carefully worded denials all around.
> >
> > All the best,
> > Jacob
> > --
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