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[liberationtech] Boundless Informant: the NSA's secret tool to track global surveillance data

Andrés Leopoldo Pacheco Sanfuentes alps6085 at gmail.com
Sun Jun 9 07:58:33 PDT 2013


This is very silly. The list would be much better served if people
would restrain from "metaflaming" on stuff that's not really " a
flame" - especially in this case, it sounds to me that's just another
instance of "friendly fire"

Best Regards | Cordiales Saludos | Grato,

Andrés L. Pacheco Sanfuentes
<alps at acm.org>
+1 (817) 271-9619


On Sun, Jun 9, 2013 at 9:25 AM, Brian Conley <brianc at smallworldnews.tv> wrote:
> +1 to the tone comments, but my verdict is still out on greenwald, though
> until I see the lawyers and privacy people talking a big game (not just
> executives) I would tend to believe there is more than a grain of accuracy.
>
> On Jun 9, 2013 6:45 AM, "Nadim Kobeissi" <nadim at nadim.cc> wrote:
>>
>> Jake,
>> I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but I'm really tired
>> of just how aggressive and rude you always are on Libtech. And it doesn't
>> appear to just be towards me. I'm not the only person who feels like this.
>>
>> Even if you're right, tone your ego knob down already. Be nice. I can
>> barely read through threads anymore. Thank you.
>>
>> NK
>>
>> On 2013-06-09, at 9:15 AM, Jacob Appelbaum <jacob at appelbaum.net> wrote:
>>
>> > x z:
>> >> 2013/6/8 Jacob Appelbaum <jacob at appelbaum.net>
>> >>
>> >>> Oh man, Glenn Greenwald is my hero and a hero to us all.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Do you still believe Glenn's reporting that NSA has "direct access to
>> >> servers of firms including Google, Apple and Facebook"?
>> >
>> >
>> > Yeah, I think it is clearly a FISA interface or API of some kind. Either
>> > that or it is pwnage of the server. Probably one or the other in some
>> > cases.
>> >
>> >> In my view, he
>> >> misled the world intentionally (the few prism training slides published
>> >> did
>> >> not seem to claim this). Glenn is at best a wacky journalist without
>> >> common
>> >> sense.
>> >
>> > He just broke the story of the decade, good to know your views on him.
>> >
>> >>
>> >> His reporting on the Verizon case was good, but I think his credibility
>> >> bankrupted after the PRISM one.
>> >
>> > We disagree, obviously. You'll see soon enough and when you're eating
>> > crow, I'm sure we'll have another discussion.
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Everyone on
>> >>> this list who was looking for 'some evidence' about global
>> >>> surveillance
>> >>> and previously ignored all other evidence, well, here you go!
>> >>>
>> >>> "Revealed: The NSA's powerful tool for cataloguing data – including
>> >>> figures on US collection"
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/08/nsa-boundless-informant-global-datamining
>> >>>
>> >>> This screenshot from the program is very web 2.0:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/6/8/1370715185657/boundless-heatmap-large-001.jpg
>> >>>
>> >>> The NSA is spying on the US and on the rest of the planet. There is no
>> >>> ability to deny this anymore. Anyone who denies it is a complete
>> >>> moron.
>> >>>
>> >>> I don't understand why this "evidence" is significant in any way. NSA
>> >> certainly has lots of information, and a web2.0'ish tool is nothing
>> >> surprising. It's rather moot to state "anyone who denies it is a
>> >> complete
>> >> moron". It's like the highway patrol keeping my driving record.
>> >>
>> >
>> > Why does it matter if you are surprised?
>> >
>> > Also, your analogy is tired and boring. This is nothing like a highway
>> > patrol.
>> >
>> >> Again, I'm not rooting for NSA. I think its power need to be limited
>> >> and it
>> >> needs more transparency. But I hate using misinformation or hyperbole
>> >> to
>> >> achieve that goal. This hurts the credibility of all the pro-privacy
>> >> groups
>> >> in general.
>> >
>> > I don't see any misinformation or hyperbole from Glenn. I see
>> > contradicting claims between governments and corporations. I also see
>> > that he wanted to ensure everyone understood what each side claimed.
>> > Note the very carefully worded denials all around.
>> >
>> > All the best,
>> > Jacob
>> > --
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>
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