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[liberationtech] Facebook: Building Global Community - What's your response to Mark Zuckerberg?
shelley at misanthropia.info
Sun Feb 19 12:19:18 PST 2017
On February 19, 2017 11:57:23 AM Alberto Cammozzo <ac+lists at zeromx.net> wrote:
> There is a "privacy divide" emerging issue there.
> Using FB may help to reach the masses, but some people (activists and
> not) will never use a FB account and will be unreachable.
> Same for Google: for instance, the link below to Google Docs is
> unavailable with my privacy setting.
> Some open source and selfhosted alternative to FB is listed here
Thank you, Alberto. For the link and for your comment. I'm one who
doesn't use Google and have never/ will never use Facebook. Both are run
by a corporate mindset and fiscal model that is openly and unapologetically
hostile to anonymity and to the privacy of 'normal' users by design. Their
use poses an unthinkable risk to h/ac(k)tivists, especially in these times.
I thank Yosem for his suggestions as well.
> On 19/02/2017 20:36, Yosem Companys wrote:
> > First of all, I want to commend Steven for all he has done over the
> > years. He was a pioneer of e-democracy in the 1990s, when the Internet
> > was a mere curiosity for most people. And Steven has worked arduously
> > over the years to help foster e-democracy around the world. That is to
> > be commended and thanked.
> > That said, Thomas, you raise important points. If we look at the
> > alternatives out there for grassroots organizing, they tend to be
> > proprietary like NationBuilder. I do not know any open-source
> > alternatives off hand.
> > Please review Rand Strauss's list at
> > Kudos to Rand for putting the list together.
> > If I want to look for good open-source solutions to start a movement
> > and I'm not tech savvy, I need either someone to build it for me or I
> > want it to be easily installed on a server.
> > That is why Bram Wets' suggestions were so on point -- I repost them
> > here in case you missed them:
> > Idea 1:
> > An idea list where the Liberationtech community can post ideas for
> > projects, upvote (and downvote) them, put your name with an idea
> > to contribute.
> > This would facilitate your call for ideas/projects ;-)
> > I actually like the format of software bugtracking. It maybe can
> > be used for such an idea list. Or a github-like structure with
> > pullrequests...
> > Idea 2:
> > An overview of tips, good practices, tools and apps for secure
> > communication and digital privacy. And the organisations and
> > platforms that work on this topic.
> > Yes, there is a lot out there and some organizations already have
> > done terrific work. So the focus has to be on the overview, not on
> > doing all there work over again.
> > Additionally we can add good practices in how to reach people and
> > teach them those privacy tools.
> > Just having a simple wiki of tools and people willing to help for free
> > or a nominal fee would be a contribution. Being able to evaluate tools
> > with up or down votes would also be a contribution.
> > In the meantime, if you go to sites like Progressive Exchange, you
> > will see that pretty much everyone recommends closed-source software
> > with questionable security for online organizing. Putting all your
> > activist friends on NationBuilder, for example, is a security risk. We
> > don't know if NationBuilder under a different management team might be
> > tempted or forced to give the entire list to the government for
> > surveillance purposes.
> > And Rick has outlined the risks of Facebook already, as Thomas writes,
> > so I won't reiterate those. Maybe we need to build another Diaspora
> > and this time build it right: open-source, best encryption,
> > Napster-like one-to-one capabilities, hosting of data in servers in
> > privacy-friendly regimes, ability to connect to the large social
> > networking sites like Hootsuite for widespread dissemination,
> > non-profit or at least cooperative status, and so on.
> > If this is a project folks are interested in, we can start doing some
> > research on what it should look like and look for funding sources to
> > make it happen.
> > Best,
> > Yosem
> > On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 11:10 AM, Thomas Delrue <thomas at epistulae.net
> > <mailto:thomas at epistulae.net>> wrote:
> > On 02/19/2017 01:46 PM, Al Billings wrote:
> > > Someone remind me again what the alternatives are to Facebook that
> > > are actually easy to use for "normal" users and which they will be
> > > able to quickly sign up and use...
> > Oh, and before I forget, why the need to "sign up"? Why is that a
> > requirement? If you're doing something that at some point could be
> > deemed subversive, why would you maintain a list of members of said
> > activity/thinking that can easily be requisitioned or compromised?
> > Why does everyone need everyone else to sign up and hand over
> > information in order to use a simple website? Why does everyone
> > want to
> > lock up everything behind a login-wall?
> > Maybe that's the big problem... Everyone thinks that you need to
> > maintain a list of users and a login form in order to run a simple
> > website...
> > --
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